• Breaking News

    Monday, March 15, 2021

    Destiny Focused Feedback: State of Gambit S13

    Destiny Focused Feedback: State of Gambit S13


    Focused Feedback: State of Gambit S13

    Posted: 15 Mar 2021 06:28 AM PDT

    Hello Guardians,

    Focused Feedback is where we take the week to focus on a 'Hot Topic' discussed extensively around the Tower.

    We do this in order to consolidate Feedback, to get out all your ideas and issues surrounding the topic in one place for discussion and a source of feedback to the Vanguard.

    This Thread will be active until next week when a new topic is chosen for discussion

    Whilst Focused Feedback is active, ALL posts regarding 'State of Gambit S13' following its posting will be removed and re-directed to this thread. Exceptions to this rule are as follows: New information / developments, Guides and general questions

    Any and all Feedback on the topic is welcome.

    Regular Sub rules apply so please try to keep the conversation on the topic of the thread and keep it civil between contrasting ideas

    A Wiki page - Focused Feedback - has also been created for the Sub as an archive for these topics going forward so they can be looked at by whoever may be interested or just a way to look through previous hot topics of the sub as time goes on.

    submitted by /u/DTG_Bot
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    Daily Questions [2021-03-16]

    Posted: 15 Mar 2021 08:00 PM PDT

    New player? Please read the New Light Guide & Gameplay Guide

    Want to buy the DLC? Beyond Light Guide

    Returning and not sure what was vaulted? Destiny Content Vault: Year 4

    Unsure what you need to pay for and what's free? Check out the Season of the Chosen Calendar

    Top Known Issues List by Bungie


    Welcome to the Daily Questions thread! Do you have a Destiny related question that needs answering? Can't find it anywhere else on the web? Well You're in luck! Simply ask your question down below, and the knowledgeable community of /r/DestinyTheGame will answer it to the best of their abilities!

    Be sure to use the search in the top right before submitting a question, as it could have already been answered. Also, be sure to check the thread itself!

    We also have a nice collection of useful resources below "Useful links" in the sidebar / top menu.

    Be sure to sort by new to see the latest questions!


    Rules


    • Absolutely no down talking. You were all new to Destiny once, so there's no need to belittle anyone just because you might know more.

    • All hateful comments that derail conversation will be removed. This thread is a place of learning, so keep it civil.


    You can find the full Daily Thread schedule here.

    submitted by /u/DTG_Bot
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    I have Autism. Thanks to 12 man raiding I have my very first Raid Lockout since 2016.

    Posted: 15 Mar 2021 05:57 PM PDT

    Really personal post here, which I don't normally do. My name is Michael, and I suffer from Asbergers Sydrome, Autism, and Severe Anxiety/Depression. It causes me to avoid large player activities since I have a lot of stress about things like Mics and "know how" of mechanics and such.

    Over the years Bungie has hit some home runs for me in terms of an alluring activity that doesn't give me social anxiety:

    1. Court of Oryx: For me the feeling of walking into that part of the map while some epic battle was going on and trying to rush to that side of the room to join is one of my top gaming moments.

    2. Forge of Iron: Loved the rewards, hated the "matchmaking".

    3. Menagerie: It's like a Raid without the pressure!

    Last week I found out about the multiple player glitch and wanted to try it out and see if it took some of the pressure off me.Thanks to large player activities in the last two weeks, I have:

    1. Cleared my first Master Nightfall. Many, many times. It was a blast.

    2. Cleared Deep Stone Crypt for the first time. It was still really nerve wracking though.

    3. Made 9 friends on steam which I didn't have before.

    I feel that this whole season has been a slam dunk for me regarding engageability for me. It's such a simple concept: Play the rituals, play battleground, pick your reward, repeat. Whatever your doing Bungie, it's A'ight.

    submitted by /u/Chordstrike1994
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    Why did I just now discover this game.

    Posted: 15 Mar 2021 09:20 AM PDT

    Holy. Shit.

    Why why why did no one tell me about this. Something with shooting mechanics on par with COD/Apex, open and beautiful worlds, nearly endless customization, all while being shared and potentially cooperative like Ghost Recon Breakpoint except actually fun. Oh. And Bunjie, the studio that got me started playing games (besides Miyamoto) made this fucking masterpiece??

    Goodbye productivity.

    Seriously, I haven't even really begun (from what I can tell, this game is ludicrously complex in depth) and I'm already blown away.

    I just described it to my friend as Apex meets Halo meets Breath of the Wild. Fuck.

    Ill be over on r/fireteams to be finding some friends to explore with, but I just wanted to express my excitement at finally trying this out. Im jealous of yall for having experienced this for the last few years and also very excited to start my own journey, as it doesn't seem like the devs are giving up on this game anytime soon and this sub alone has 2 million members.

    See ya out there.

    EDIT: HOLY SMOKES. I did not expect this to blow up, let alone have 20+ messages in my inbox of people saying they want to play with me/show me around the game.

    Y'all freakin rule. Even if this sub can get salty from what I'm told, I dont see that right now. All I see is a community of people who are genuinely stoked and want to play a fun game with each other.

    This rules. Thank you for the awards, DMs, and everything else. I'll respond to you when I can. Currently going to visit a friend and ski/ride bikes but as soon as my dirtbag needs are met I'll be back online and ready to party. You all rock. Godspeed.

    Edit 2: my comparisons may be trash, but take into account I litterally have like 2.5 hours into this game and came back to gaming after a decade thus last year for obvious reasons (fuck a virus). Most of my time was in Apex and MW19/WZ, just got into BotW. When I first booted it up it felt like an amalgamation of all of those, but of course it's its own thing.

    submitted by /u/mr_trashbear
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    On behalf of more casual, single-character players, I'd like to compliment Bungie for the way Bright Dust has been handled recently.

    Posted: 15 Mar 2021 09:58 AM PDT

    Having the time for one character used to mean skipping 2/3 of the weekly bright dust offering.

    Now ? Between the vendor rework, the season pass, and the seasonal challenges (which are great since I can also do them whenever I work), I'm getting literally SHOWERED in bright dust whenever I play. We're barely at the half of the season and I have earned 10k dust already. It's amazing.

    I can actually look up the eververse weekly planning knowing I'll have enough dust for basically everything I want. And I can work towards getting a big 4k dust package (that's almost a full armor set !) by working out all the challenges.

    As far as cosmetic currencies go, I think this game is more than fair now.

    submitted by /u/McManus26
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    I’d stay out of gambit for a while, as later challenges have you doing a lot in it again. Spoilers for future challenges.

    Posted: 15 Mar 2021 05:30 PM PDT

    For the unaware, all of the remaining challenges have been datamined already. I went through the ones we still haven't seen with some friends of mine to see what we should be planning ahead for.

    While some of these may be retroactive, I wouldn't bet on that.

    SPOILERS. Here's a spreadsheet with all of the rest of the challenges, thank you to whoever made it!

    Here's the big gambit problems, for those of you who don't wanna dig through that:

    Week 8: "Clearing The Inner Circle" Kill 40 Primeval Envoys

    Week 9: "Feels Good To Be Bad" Kill 40 guardians in gambit. Bonus progress for kills while invading.

    Additionally here's some other painful ones:

    • Complete a GM nightfall (week 6)
    • Win 7 Rounds of Trials of Osiris (week 7, also gives you a random trials weapon when you complete it)
    • Get each of the ornaments for Salvager's Salvo (weeks 6-8)
    • Earn 5 Valor ranks (week 7, matches the gambit one from this week)
    • Get 80 guardians with elemental kills in Iron Banner. Bonus progress for stasis kills (week 10)
    • Kill 50 combatants in the new strike IN IT'S NIGHTFALL FORM with a linear fusion or a sidearm (week 8)
    • Kill 20 boss or elite cabal in the new strike (week 10)
    • Kill 400 targets while wearing a matching armor set. Bonus progress on guardian kills. (Week 9)
    • Kill 600 targets with grenades or rocket launchers. Bonus progress for multikills. (Week 10)

    There's a few more gross ones but these are the ones that I think most people are gonna complain about.

    So, if you're already putting off doing stuff in crucible, you might as well continue putting it off. Remember that there's some time after the last week ends, as there's exactly 28 days between when week 10 starts (April 13th) and when the season ends (May 11th).

    Also remember that you can skip some challenges and still get the bright dust at the end. There's 77 challenges total and you need 75 for the big reward.

    edit: thanks for the awards? But also. If you're dreading the trials one, make sure your calendar is open on March 26 through 28th. Why?

    Because that's the weekend of trials that is first available after that challenge drops.

    Meaning more people are gonna be there than any other time of the season.

    Meaning more people who are not the best at destiny will be there.

    Meaning you're more likely to get easy/fair/easier games than normal.

    So clear out that slot in your time and get your grind on! Plan ahead with some friends or just get an LFG together on that day. If you're willing to attempt that challenge, that weekend is going to be the best it's gonna get.

    Obviously don't bother if you're not willing to try that out. But if you wanna see if you can get that challenge done easy/easier than it would be, do it that weekend.

    submitted by /u/T_Gamer-mp4
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    Adept Weapons from Trials/GM NFs should roll with 2 perks in the final perk column.

    Posted: 15 Mar 2021 12:53 PM PDT

    After going Flawless 3x in Trials this weekend just to get 3 badly rolled Messenger's, especially none with Desperado, feels bad. Putting in that much work, just to have a slim chance at the roll you want, feels really bad. There needs to be a differentiator to non-Adept weapons, aside from Adept mods that don't really add much to the weapon. Getting the roll you want should be a little easier and the gun should offer more flexibility with additional perk slots.

     

    submitted by /u/HiddnAce
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    Make Petra sell weapon frames to let us farm DC gun rolls

    Posted: 15 Mar 2021 05:26 PM PDT

    See title, we don't have any way to really farm, we need something similar to the moon weapon frames.

    submitted by /u/darkelement1987
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    Bring back the class swords in guardian games

    Posted: 15 Mar 2021 09:31 AM PDT

    Best time to bring them back with random rolls

    Get it done!

    submitted by /u/Edt-el-man
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    The sheer emotions I'm feeling, having just beaten prophecy solo AND flawless

    Posted: 15 Mar 2021 05:30 PM PDT

    Disbelief. Relief. Joy. Lingering RAGE (GOD. DAMN. KNIGHTS). Mixture of the four.

    God bless the awesome visuals. God bless attunement of hunger and GOD BLESS RISKRUNNER.

    The emblem is staying on for as long as i play this game

    submitted by /u/Main-Curve-2320
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    My clanmates laughed 2 seasons ago, when I masterworked my high stat Aeon Cult set. Guess what exotics they want me to use for Grandmaster tomorrow!

    Posted: 15 Mar 2021 08:56 PM PDT

    https://imgur.com/a/ymKegKb

    To be fair, we ran a shitload of double loot Lake of Shadows, and were masterworking just about anything in the vault.

    For some reason, the game likes giving me high stat/high distribution Aeons. When these things were a meme, I was deleting 66+ rolls, 20+ distribution pieces simply because I had these in the vault collecting dust.

    They deleted their Aeons, because after all....... who would ever use Aeons! Now that they're buffed, all of a sudden I've become everyone's Grandmaster buddy knowing I can produce ammo for the team.

    submitted by /u/JLoco11PSN
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    Dredgen Is A Stark Reminder

    Posted: 15 Mar 2021 05:20 PM PDT

    I finally got Dredgen.

    Not gilded. Just regular Dredgen.

    My last triumph needed was Dark Age Arsenal.

    It requires a Gambit weapon in every slot.

    The new gambit weapons (bottom dollar and trinary system (thanks for pointing out that cartesian coordinate is the wrong name lmao u/TemporalAlchemy) don't work for it. (at least, I tried CC [TS] once, and it didn't trigger even though we won)

    I had to go on a hunt to discover what original gambit weapons were still not sunset.

    The answer is, no specials, and just one heavy.

    The curated Bad Omens from Drifter, (I dismantled all my other Bad Omens) for heavy, and gnawing hunger, lonesome, and Nightwatch for primaries. also, malfeasance counts, I believe.

    Python is sunset.

    last man standing is sunset.

    Sole Survivor is sunset.

    doomsday and just in case: sunset.

    literally, every special and heavy I could think of, all sunset.

    I'm glad the "horrors" of sunsetting are over, but its effects still remain.

    I will grieve for my fallen friends. Rest well, dear Python. Tell Cayde I said hello.

    submitted by /u/AValiantSoul
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    Finally Unlocked my Unbroken title last night by winning a 1v4. My heart was pounding out of my chest, and I was extremely proud of the plays. I just wanted to share.

    Posted: 15 Mar 2021 07:38 AM PDT

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XudrCjj1NU8

    Both teammates were dead and the enemy team was up one life, hence the 1v4. Just wanted to put that out there before someone comments saying that it was actually a 1v3. I guess I actually mean a 1v3 + 1 life. The clip is pretty short, it only shows the clutches at the very end of the match.

    submitted by /u/I3igB
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    Bungie, I saw a interview where you guys said Forsaken might be sunset because it's confusing that Uldren was bad and is now good. It's really not. And if it WAS, issues like this are better solved with a Haunted style "What you missed in D2" cutscene covering past rare events when starting.

    Posted: 15 Mar 2021 12:22 AM PDT

    I can understand if you want to sunset a specific place, but don't use excuses like this. It can be perceived as thinking that your players are idiots. Most players are smart enough to go "Uldren was evil, but he's good now, there must be a reason for that."

    And if they are NOT, then issues like "We were at war with The Cabal, why are we joined with them Against Savathun?" or "Wait where the hell is Cayde-6?" can be easily solved with a simple "Hey, it's been a while, here is what happened in the past few years of content" type of cutscene, rather then removing content because you think players are dumb.

    submitted by /u/Kylestien
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    Gambit is one of the, if not THE, most miserable experiences I’ve had playing this game

    Posted: 15 Mar 2021 03:16 AM PDT

    Speaking as someone who grinded out Gambit to reset their infamy this week, Gambit is tied with Trials as the worst game mode currently in Destiny. An absolutely miserable time for anyone who isn't in a four stack, Gambit's problems include:

    • Playing on the same four maps because there hasn't been a new map since season six and the others got put into the DCV.
    • Power ammo still swinging games to a ridiculous degree. As much fun as it is getting repeatedly killed by Xenophage/Eyes of Tomorrow/Truth spamming invaders, it's not.
    • Power ammo not dropping for an entire match for some players and dropping frequently for others.
    • The team that pulls ahead even for a moment wins the match most of the time as they can spam invasions and absolutely nuke their boss (especially with swords and the new titan chest piece), regardless of the progress of the other team.
    • Solo's being queued against three and four stacks.
    • Motes still being buggy when you pick them up off the ground. (There seems to be a new issue where motes fly into the air and back down again or just get stuck under the ground? Not sure if it's just me.)
    • As u/avacadont said, another issue happens with enemies just not spawning in after killing off a wave for minutes at a time.
    • Drop rates of the weapons still being low. I played around 25 or so games and received the fusion rifle twice and didn't get the hand cannon at all.

    Any improvements Prime made to the game mode have not been carried over to this current iteration of Gambit. And given that there was zero mention of Gambit in the State of the Game TWAB, I can't believe that Bungie is currently happy with how the game mode is currently playing out. Please can we get some improvements to it so something considered a core activity is actually bearable to play?

    submitted by /u/BaileyMoore___
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    I've never felt so powerless against a hunter who can just teleport passed me and slow me at the same time.

    Posted: 15 Mar 2021 08:03 PM PDT

    Just strip me of my abilities. My reaction to fight back.

    Freeze me why don't you.

    submitted by /u/AuraPinkario
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    Maybe just me, but I really want a heavy ammo trace rifle

    Posted: 15 Mar 2021 07:48 AM PDT

    We got a heavy ammo bow (Leviathan's Breath), a heavy ammo fusion rifle (One Thousand Voices), shotguns (Legend of Acrius and Tractor Cannon), and snipers (D.A.R.C.I. and Whisper of the Worm)

    I think it's time for a heavy ammo trace rifle that hopefully won't be nerfed (cough cough Ruinous Effigy cough cough pls buff cough)

    submitted by /u/iCoolbeans
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    Prismatic Recaster is a waste of time!

    Posted: 15 Mar 2021 12:54 PM PDT

    I just can't do it anymore. I was excited to try to farm a good SMG after unlocking the Tier 3 SMG/Sidearm Umbral. That was until I unlocked 5 straight Brass Attacks, none of which equal the rolls I have gotten from just playing the game. Honestly, it is too much work. Not that BA is a bad gun...it's just where's the variety here? There are a couple of different weapons that can roll and I get the same one 5 straight times? SMH

    I told myself if I didn't roll anything different on my 5th try, I was done grinding battlegrounds...so I am done playing that mode until the new season...so that's a plus.

    submitted by /u/Nice_Sense4627
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    Made Some Weapon Models in 3D

    Posted: 15 Mar 2021 06:59 PM PDT

    Hello,

    I've just been practicing ye ol' 3D art and decided to use some awesome concepts from @Tosthage on Twitter for practice (The weapons are entirely her creation, I just 3D-ified them). Don't see too many art posts here generally so I thought I'd throw mine into the mix.

    Counterblow Forge - Anarchy Ornament

    The Seedbed - Pulse Rifle

    Thanks for looking! :]

    submitted by /u/DenalCC1010
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    To the Blueberries that use Divinity in Gambit, I appreciate the heck out of you.

    Posted: 15 Mar 2021 09:32 AM PDT

    In an era where bosses melt, you make the work that much easier.

    Cheers!

    submitted by /u/TheMediocreThor
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    Article 12: Destiny 2's 12 Man Activity Glitch Needs To Be A Feature In The Future

    Posted: 15 Mar 2021 06:53 PM PDT

    Hello Guardians! Super busy with school stuff lately, been slacking on the articles. I would appreciate any feedback you have to offer to learn and improve! As usual, an external link is provided should you prefer to read it on WordPress (pictures are viewable there).

    https://mysticaridia.wordpress.com/2021/03/16/destiny-2s-12-man-activity-glitch-needs-to-be-a-feature-in-the-future/

    Destiny 2's 12 Man Activity Glitch Needs To Be A Feature In The Future

    Between the interesting unfolding of the Battlegrounds, there has been an extremely fun aspect these past 2 weeks. I am speaking of no other than 12-man activities. With some precise timing and luck, players have been breezing through several activities in more Fireteams than intended, and my oh my, has it been a blast. This glitch only works with non-matchmade activities, so thank the Traveller you won't be facing a team of 12 in Control, Gambit, or Trials (which is disabled, again).

    It's the last day of 12-man activities in Destiny 2, as Update 3.1.1 will be patching this on weekly reset. Bungie needs to make 12-man activities a thing in the future. While I don't mean that they should launch every of the upcoming activities, for example the returning Vault of Glass with room for 12 players. However there is a certain aspect of fun and chaos to it, call it Mayhem Mode, if you will.

    Most activities in the game are set to Fireteam members of 3 and 6, but having an extra Fireteam or two has never been more glorious. The filled to the brim roster page, the sheer number of Guardians in a small room, how quickly enemies can be defeated, even the other way around (looking at you, Exploder Shank from Fallen S.A.B.E.R), and have I told you of how hilarious it is to stomp a Fallen Skiff down?

    This has been a great way for new players to try out various non-matchmade endgame activities too, I've lost count of the numbers of 12-man raids I've joined where several were raiding for the very first time as they looked around in awe of what a raid has to offer. As RNG would have it, some lucky ones were blessed with the raid Exotics on their first try. It easily brought a more welcoming feeling to them to try more of these activities, no matter how little the participation.

    12-man Fireteams have also brought cheeses to several Triumphs, such as the Tale Told Triumph in the Exotic Quest: Presage. Players have to complete the mission on Master difficulty without dying, but you can easily sit at spawn while the 11 other Guardians in your Fireteam breeze through the mission. With it rewards a lovely Tex Mechanica themed emblem.

    Props to Bungie for letting the glitch stick around for players to have fun for a while rather than patching it immediately. Bungie could either have the option to create an activity for 12-man Fireteams, but that may be tricky in terms of mechanics as you'd have to factor in so many Guardians, not to mention how quickly you could melt a boss' health. While I do understand that these endgame activities are a source of high stat loot and resources, that it may break the reward structure if 12-man Fireteams were active all the time, I would love to see a return of it for the sake of players who face difficulties in tackling them and for some much enjoyed fun.

    I believe the appeal is more towards the fact that Destiny 2 players miss and want a 6 player matchmade activity. I know I have complimented the targeted loot farm back in Menagerie several times, the Menagerie also had casual fun for all its players. Back then, players would be able to farm multiple copies of any weapon/gear they desired after a glitch was discovered by loading back and forth between areas. Being able to load into an activity with 12 people has somewhat effectively filled the experience of Menagerie's absence.

    If this 12-man glitch were ever to return in the future, there's several possibilities that Bungie could add. Additional modifiers, harder difficulties, exclusive challenges and perhaps exclusive loot and mods! You may recall in April 2020, a double loot glitch from the Nightfall Warden of Nothing had eventually turned into a feature where we periodically get double loot from Nightfalls, so here's hoping that 12-man activities will have the same fate.

    Until then, treasure the remaining time of this unique glitch we have left Guardians, and an early good luck to those who will be attempting Grandmaster difficulty on reset.

    submitted by /u/MysticAridia
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    Now that you changed Borealis's element change animation, can you change it's catalyst?

    Posted: 15 Mar 2021 10:03 AM PDT

    It's catalyst gave it increased reload so it could cycle The Fundamentals easier, but now its just increased reload speed for the heck of it. Maybe give it "Lightbender", which gives a combination of Dragonfly and Shield Disorient that gets stronger when Ionic Return is active? Another idea is similar to Hawkmoon's catalyst, increased reload, range and handling while Ionic Trace is active and an extra shot in the mag? Last one I have off the top of my head is rapid matched shield breaks spawn an orb of power. IDK I'm not that creative but I would just love to see this weapon get a more functioning catalyst. Also this is not a priority, I would like catalyst-less weapons like Xenophage, Wish-Ender and Malfeasance to get catalysts first.

    submitted by /u/Personplayer4
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    Despite PVP Balance issues, Stasis integrates lore and gameplay very well

    Posted: 15 Mar 2021 06:56 AM PDT

    When Stasis first was revealed to be an ice/freezing based subclass, I was skeptical as to how exactly this was supposed to reflect the Darkness. It was black-blue ice, sure, but I couldnt help but feel a bit disappointed that it wasnt something more aesthetically linked to my mental image of "Darkness".

    However, now that Beyond Light has been out for months and weve gotten our hands on the subclass, I realize that its so much more than just "ice", and Im pretty happy with what Bungie has crafted. It actually integrates many themes associated with the Darkness in the lore and story with the way it behaves during gameplay.

    • The Darkness as the anchor to the Light

    The Knife had a million blades.

    And you were giant, powerful and swift. But the Knife pinned you. Cut your godly flesh away.

    Taken from "Ghost Fragment: The Traveler 3

    The lore piece above is from the "Dreams of Alpha Lupi" series from Destiny 1, which are written from the Traveler´s point of view. The specific fragment I linked describes the battle between the Traveler and the Pyramid Ships during the Collapse.

    The Traveler describes being "pinned" before being cut away and wounded.

    Now, as basically every pvp player has learned since Beyond Light, what does it feel to be frozen by Stasis?

    Youre pinned in place. Frozen, but conscious. You see the person who will kill you begin to shoot you and your health begins to slowly tick. Or its a Hunter and you see them jump, bracing for the inevitable Shatterdive. Or its a Titan and you see them slide toward you.

    You can try and break free. The button promp is there. Most of the time it is futile however, and you just die.

    You feel helpless. Like the Traveler battling the Pyramids.

    Or how Supers can be frozen by Stasis and sometimes defeated afterward. Something that just feels fundamentally wrong.

    But read the lore piece again.

    "You were giant, powerful and swift. But the Knife pinned you. Cut your godly flesh away."

    This is a gameplay flavor win. The Darkness is the only thing that can shut down the Light in such an absolute way. Take the power fantasy of a Guardian and stop it dead in its tracks.

    • The Darkness as a force of control and order in contrast to the Light as a force of chaos and possibility

    The gardener got up and brushed their knees. "Every game we play, this one pattern consumes all the others. Wipes out every interesting development. A stupid, boring exploit that cuts off entire possibility spaces from ever arising. There's so much that we'll never get to see because of this… pest."

    They chewed at their cracked lip, which existed only because this is an allegory. "I'm going to do something about it," they said. "We need a new rule."

    Taken from "The Final Shape", from the Unveiling lore book.

    All you will do, I said, with rising panic|fury, is delay the dominant pattern that will overrun the others. It is inevitable. One final shape.

    "No, it'll be different. Everything will be different, everywhere you look."

    Everything will be the same. Your new rule will only make great false cysts of horror full of things that should not exist that cannot withstand existence that will suffer and scream as their rich blisters fill with effluent and rot around them, and when they pop they will blight the whole garden. Whatever exists because it must exist and because it permits no other way of existence has the absolute claim to existence. That is the only law.

    "No," the gardener said, "I am the growth and preservation of complexity. I will make myself into a law in the game."

    Taken from "The First Knife", from the Unveiling lore book.

    The fundamental difference, and conflict, between the Light and the Darkness is one between simplicty and complexity.

    The Winnower, entity behind the Darkness, believes in the order of the original proto universe that was the Garden. Where only one possiblity, one pattern, managed to thrive at the expense of all other possibilities. The Winnower believes that the universe, and all life within it, are heading toward one single conclusion. One single species to survive among a graveyard of trillions, because only one pattern can make it there.

    The Gardener, entity behind the Light, believes in the chaos of life given opportunity. The many possibilties and branching paths the game can explore if it is simply let to do so. The freedom of life to grow in whatever way it pleases and chooses, rather than be forced down a single path because it is simply the most dominant.

    Two opposite ideologies.

    So it makes sense then, that every single Light subclass so far is based on doing raw damage or clearing adds with roaming supers, while Stasis is designed to do one thing extremely well.

    Control.

    Because this is what the Darkness is in the end. Its oppressive, it stiffles hope and freedom.

    The Pyramids chase the Traveler around, genociding every single species that has received her gifts, turning planets she has terraformed and undoing the work, turning them back to lifeless rocks, or worse, corrupting them and twisting their form, because the Winnower wants a universe where the Light doesnt meddle with what it considers to be the natural order of things.

    So when you go around breaking reality with your super in pvp, Stasis is there to freeze your ass and negate your space magic, because its what the Pyramids have done to the Traveler for millions of years now.

    Is it fun gameplay to go against? Depends on who you ask, but this is as Darkness as Darkness can get.

    You wanted Darkness subclasses? You get Darkness subclasses.

    Reality is chaotic and unruly; bind it, and bring it order.

    Taken from the Warlock Shadebinder Subclass.

    • Darkness as an alluring force

    "You remember on Io," Yardarm-14 couldn't contain his enthusiasm, "we were pinned down inside that shipping container with Phalanxes closing in from all sides, and you—you bastard. You ducked out a little hole in the back and made a run for it. I thought you'd left us behind."

    "Never," said Lisbon-13 with vehemence. His eyes flashed with anger, but Yardarm-4 didn't seem to notice.

    "I know. The whole box was rattling with bullets, and there were explosions, and we were shooting when we could, and suddenly, through it all, I hear you screaming. It was like a banshee wail. You came screaming back on an Interceptor—the Psion still in it. You were steering it with the Psion's head!"

    "I remember."

    "And you rammed it through four Phalanxes from the side, and then, and then—you remember this, Rekkana?"

    "I can't forget."

    "You splashed that Interceptor across the shields of another Phalanx, and you RODE THE EXPLOSION over the top. And when you hit the ground behind them, BOOM! It was the most beautiful thing I've ever seen."

    Lisbon-13 said nothing. It was as if the story had shut him down.

    "That's us right now. We're doing what you did. This whole universe is like that container, and the Last City, the Vanguard, the Traveler—they're all inside that box. But we just snuck out of a hole in the back.

    Taken from the Boots of Ascendancy lore tab, which are the Garden of Salvation Titan leg armor.

    We are no longer forced to endure your torture. There is no veil for you to hide behind. We see you plainly. Your orchestration has led to too many foul notes. All your attempts to subjugate this power have failed.

    You are a plague, and we are the cure. Your army will be eradicated, and the Hive will be a layer of dust, cushioning our footsteps. Trust me—you will hate it.

    I find myself giddy at these thoughts. Revenge suits me, it seems. I no longer know fear. I am overcome with certainty. When next we come face-to-face, I will remove the bandages that shield me, so I may see you for all you are and all you are not. And you will see me and know that the fire that burns behind my eyes will be your oblivion, suffocating and searing you to ash.

    Prepare yourself. I am your ruin.

    Taken from "To the Witch Queen", from Eris Morn´s Regarding Stasis lore book.

    The lore tabs I linked showcase the psychological effects that Darkness has on its wielders. The first is from Yardarm-14, member of the Kentarch-3 fireteam which embraced the Darkness inside the Black Garden.

    The second is from Eris Morn, who wields Stasis as of Beyond Light, possibly even all the way back to Shadowkeep, if the cutscene with her inside the Pyramid Ship is any indication.

    The Darkness feels good. It doesnt feel like a force of evil and death. It makes you surer of yourself, more confident in your abilities. Free from shackles and limitations.

    Which is ironic, because once youre corrupted youre a tool of the Winnower, while the Light doesnt shackle you to anything.

    But think on this lore, and how it feels to use Stasis in pvp and pve. It feels really good, doesnt it?

    Its fun, unique, and very very strong. I find it really satisfying to freeze a super and kill the user when I manage to pull it off in Crucible.

    It feels amazing to freeze a bunch of enemies with my Titan Behemoth and then slide into them, crushing them all into bits. The Behemoth Super also feels the best, in my opinion, making the world quake as I smash the gauntlet into the ground, freezing everything in front of me as I fly through the air with the melee attack or slide into the crystals, shredding everything around them to bits.

    The sound design as well. The sound of ice crystals being created, the crunch of ice shattering under my might, the reverberating sounds when you cast Winter´s Wrath (which makes everyone in the vicinity go "oh shit" if its on Crucible), etc.

    This is all to say, that Stasis feels really good in a way the Light subclasses just cannot compare to.

    And thats despite me enjoying the lore of this game obsessively, and being aware that the fun ice powers are the biggest no no in the story for many reasons that have been stated to us throughout the years.

    And this is all a flavor win of design, because of course the Winnower would make his powers attractive and alluring.

    Why would anyone join the force of genocide and all around evil of this setting willingly? Because what it offers is very difficult to resist.

    Think on what Zavala said at the end of Beyond Light´s campaign.

    "Kridis is defeated. But it is not the Fallen that concern me now......

    Its us.

    Ive had time to think. Guardians are not immune to corruption. The pursuit of power has divided us before.

    I dont know what comes next. But I know- I know- that we must remain in the Light.

    I see fractures already. If we bend, we break.

    Guardians must not use the Darkness. This is the Vanguard´s official position."

    Reads kind of like a joke now, doesnt it? Has anyone here seriously followed Zavala´s order?

    Most havent. Stasis is rampart on pvp, strikes, gambit, raids, everywhere. The Darkness is everywhere.

    Zavala, the highest ranking authority within the Guardians, got completely ignored.

    But there arent any consequences to using the fun ice powers right?

    Well, not for now at least.

    submitted by /u/Edumesh
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    art i did of a vex goblin

    Posted: 15 Mar 2021 09:43 PM PDT

    “We’re breaking up those teams to find a better match” is a redundant statement at this point

    Posted: 15 Mar 2021 10:55 AM PDT

    Most times I just go into the next game with 80% of the same players or go into a new lobby that results in a mercy. Absolute joke.

    submitted by /u/ualbertathrowaway-
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    Maybe it's just me but looking back on content I feel like Oryx was the last time I felt there was an actual threat in Destiny that felt so rewarding to defeat

    Posted: 15 Mar 2021 08:04 AM PDT

    And allow me to elaborate more on that before passing judgement. Ghaul was a bigger threat. I mean it was the first time we were ever lightless. However, tying up the story in the main story line and leaving us with the Leviathan as a raid really shortened that feeling of "danger." Calus was hardly a threat and actually provided us with rewards. The Taken King expansion drew out the plot a lot longer and tied it all up with the King's Fall raid. Seeing how huge Oryx was during the raid and actually having a challenge to defeat the main threat at the time was so much more satisfying. Not to mention, in my opinion, the dreadnaught was one of my favorite destinations in destiny history and very elaborate with quite a few secrets and things to do. Plus watching victims get "taken" by being sucked into a black hole was pretty threatening.

    Fast forward to more recent events; the pyramids/darkness were ominous and creepy last season, taking over our ghost and speaking through them, the floating bodies everywhere. It's been the backstory of all of destiny, the "darkness chasing the light." Then it arrives and... Gives us its power? And Taniks? What's he gonna do? He was snow-covered lying under a pile of scrap. I throughly enjoy the DSC raid, don't get me wrong. I just don't really feel like in the Destiny universe it compares to defeating Oryx and that nothing has really come close to giving me that feeling of a drawn out accomplishment that means as much.

    submitted by /u/Lord-Opossum
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